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Alistair Overeem sues management
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Soesoeki
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Dit interview met Bas Rutten zet je toch wel aan het denken 
BAS RUTTEN TALKS MOVIES, TV, CHAEL SONNEN, AND ALISTAIR OVEREEM
When I scheduled an interview with former UFC and Pancrase champion "El Guapo" Bas Rutten, I expected the standard good stuff that he always provides whenever speaking with the media. Little did I realize that halfway through the interview I would step on a landmine, causing Bas to go off in a way that I've rarely heard him do in public.
PAUL LAZENBY: As a lot of your fans already know, your new movie "Here Comes The Boom" is now in post-production and will be released early next year. What can you tell us about your experience shooting it, and what can moviegoers expect?
BAS RUTTEN: It was a very cool experience. I worked with Kevin [James] before, but never like this. This is the biggest role of my career, a really big part, and it's comedy--I LOVE comedy! On top of that, I worked with Henry Winkler, "The Fonz", who I of course watched as a kid. He's a really nice guy. And Salma Hayek, well, I knew her from the movie "From Dusk Till Dawn", all the way back. Boy, did she leave an impression! (laughs). And you know what? People are going to find out she's really funny! Tough as well, very talented, she asked me every time to show her [fighting techniques], and every fighter on the set was blown away with how fast she picked things up, it was really crazy. Her father used to be a scrapper, she told me. She's hilarious. And what to expect? People can expect a really fun family movie about MMA. They will be amazed with how Kevin James looks; he moved to 218 pounds for the movie, very impressive. He moves great, watch till you see him hit the focus mitts! We just had Rich Franklin on Inside MMA and he saw Kevin hitting the mitts and was impressed, he told us.
PL: I heard that Chael Sonnen had a small role in the film. In the past he has had some derogatory things to say about you. Did that result in any tension between you two on set?
BR: Nah, I just stayed out of his way, but on his last day, when he was done with his scene, he walked with me back to my trailer. He started talking about the time that he said those things. He said: "It was a long time ago, I did stupid stuff, I don't even know why I did it" and he apologized. You know me, I'm an easy guy, and I always liked him, I really did, so it's all good. Plus, in the past, I of course said back what I wanted! For every action there is a reaction, so it's not like I didn't respond! (laughs)
PL: It was recently announced that Chael will be receiving a second shot at Anderson Silva's UFC middleweight title. He came within a hair's breadth of defeating Silva in his previous attempt, how do you think he'll fare in the rematch?
BR: Anderson is gonna be more ready now, and he better come in shape. I mean, Chael looked freaking awesome his last fight [vs. Brian Stann]! Unreal stamina, plus he finished his opponent. That's what was missing in the past, finish capability. Let's hope he puts a bag in front of a cable machine, jumps on top, grabs a handle from the cable machine, and start punching the bag, this way he strengthens his core, gets more power for his ground and pound.
PL: Your new show "Punk Payback" just launched on the FOX-owned FUEL station. What can you tell us about it?
BR: [When] a security camera picks up something bad, whether it's a robbery, purse snatch, pick pocket or car jack, anything bad, we watch the clip. [Then] I tell the people at home what the victims should have done. And then I say: "Let's see what I would do in this situation". After that, we go on a set identical to the crime scene and reenact the whole thing with me in the spot of the victim. We let the bad guy or guys...or girls, El Guapo is not a coïtusist (laughs)...we let them come in, and "dengerdedengerdedeng!" I show the people at home how to take care of that situation. It's funny, "light" presented, you know, done with a smile but the techniques I use are real. If you like the Bas Rutten Street Fighting video on YouTube, you are gonna love this.
PL: As part of the monumental deal that UFC has with the FOX network, FUEL will be airing over 2000 hours of UFC programming in 2012. What impact do you think that deal will have on the sport of MMA? Do you feel that it will benefit your show as well?
BR: It's gonna do really well for MMA, more people can see it now on a MAJOR Network, that's the key here. FOX has great programming and a huge audience. Even though you think FUEL might be different from the bigger FOX stations, you will realize it's not when you see the promotion for it on FOX, or FX, or FSN. I heard 5.7 million people watched [the "UFC on FOX" special], that's a good start! They also showed the "24/7"-looking deal that told the stories of Cain [Velasquez] and Junior [Dos Santos] before the fights happened. This way, the people at home who don't know the two headliners could get familiar with them. Very smart!
PL: A while back, this website covered the Kim Couture scandal, in which an inept referee allowed Couture to remain locked in a choke long after she had fallen unconscious. Have you seen footage of that incident, and if so, how do you feel about the Calgary Athletic Commission, which oversaw the bout, not only choosing to take no action against the ref, but also allowing him to judge at a recent event?
BR: I saw that fight, but you see this everywhere, it's insane! They should "red flag" the guy. Somebody has to make a website with the referees on there who messed up big time, this way you can keep a track record of it, and then when they did it three times, force them to do a referee course. Big John has great ones! Even better would be [to make it so] every referee needs to do a course, no matter what. If you don't, then you can't referee, period. Just like you test amateur fighters to become pro, you should do this with referees as well.
We all wanna stay away from bad outcomes, and referees should make sure that doesn't happen. Thankfully the Couture fight didn't become a tragedy, since it's very hard to kill a person with a choke. I mean, the police are even allowed to use it, and you know as well as I do, they are not supposed to do anything forceful.
PL: You recently enrolled your youngest daughter in judo classes with Olympic Bronze Medalist and current MMA fighter "Rowdy" Ronda Rousey. How did this come about, and how is your daughter liking judo?
BR: Darin Harvey, Ronda's manager, is one of my best friends. Ronda is teaching privates to a 10 years old girl and heard that my daughter Bianca was that age. You know as well as I do that it's always better to teach two people, this way you can show a technique on one person and the other one can watch, so that's when she asked if Bianca would be interested. First Bianca was not, until I told her how good Ronda was and showed her pictures of Ronda, and then [Bianca] was sold. On top of that, Ronda brought her pink gi jacket that she came out with in her last fight, and gave it to Bianca. That really sealed the deal. And Bianca loves it, she is very excited every time. Yesterday evening she was throwing me...I'm not kidding!
PL: The MMA world suffered a horrible blow last summer with the death of trainer Shawn Tompkins. Shawn was a very close friend of yours and often cited you as one of his primary influences. How has it been for you in trying to adjust to his loss?
BR: Just horrible. One of those situations that you don't really believe, you know? I talked to him two evenings before it happened. It was weird, he texted me with a problem, I felt it needed to be addressed, so thankfully I called him. He was out with his friend "Muscle Beach", and Muscle Beach was messed up. Shawn was not, but he said: "I have never left a man behind!" (laughs) We started right away messing around, and the problem never even came up. I told him I loved him, and when we hang up I received some more text messages that I answered, funny ones. It was weird, the last one said something like this: "I love you, Bas, Team Tompkins loves you, thanks for everything you have done for me." Wow--wild when you later find out this was the last message. I'm gonna miss him dearly.
PL: This December, Brock Lesnar will be returning to the Octagon after his second enforced absence due to serious intestinal problems. This time he had a section of his colon removed, but states that he's now 100%. Do you think that that's true, or will his health issues continue to compromise his performance?
BR: I hope not, he's gonna have a tough opponent. Brock is one of those guys who take training to the next level. I hear he is doing really good and surprising people at his gym, really getting much better. No secret here, he needs this fight on the ground!
PL: Strikeforce, K-1 and Dream champion (and your fellow countryman) Alistair Overeem will be battling Lesnar on December 30th with a UFC world title shot at stake. There has been a lot going on with Overeem lately, including the shocking news that Alistair was leaving the Golden Glory team and firing his managers. Have you discussed any of this with him, maybe found out his reasons for doing it?
BR: Oh no, you didn't go there! (laughs) I thought that if nobody asks, I won't say anything, but now that you ask me I have to! It's been bothering me a lot! OK, here I go.
It's a money thing. He simply doesn't want to pay the people who made him. When he lost three fights in a row...well, like pretty much 5, I mean, he lost, won, lost three times in a row, won, and lost again...and nobody wanted to have him.
But his management kept pushing and using the power that they have because they have other great fighters. Like, for example [they would say]: "If you want Semmy Schilt to fight, then you have to take Alistair as well."
It's funny how fighters think. When it goes bad with them, their team is everything to them, and they love their team. In interviews after they win a fight, they say: "I owe everything to my team". Then when the management starts to put great fights together for them, directing their careers and the fighter gets better and better, some of them simply can't handle it, and it gets to their head.
I had a bad feeling already when he called himself, after he won the K-1 Grand Prix, a "legend". He actually said in an interview right after he won: "I am a legend now". I don't think a fighter can ever make that comment about himself.
And talking about the Grand Prix, let's face it, he had a great deal of luck as well there. He fought Peter Aerts who had a WAR with Semmy Schilt [previously that night] and was completely banged up, and then he fought [Gokhan] Saki, who had a broken arm AND hand, in the finals! At that moment when you win, you should say: "I'm very happy with the result, the stars were in line for me tonight, I also got a little bit of luck". Because everybody is going to say that about you anyway, you might as well simply say it yourself to keep the people respecting you, but NOT: "I'm a legend".
PL: Wow, sounds like you're genuinely pissed off at Alistair about this.
BR: Of course, I see it too many times. I KNOW what Golden Glory did for him. He couldn't punch or kick when he came to them, and I mean, HE COULDN'T PUNCH OR KICK! Some fighters get big and then forget who was fighting for them when they were losing. Two months ago, he wanted to make a belt for the Golden Glory team with "FOR CHAMPION MANAGEMENT" engraved on it. Those were HIS words after they made this huge contract for him, and now he says they are morons? He used them to negotiate the best deal and when they did it, now suddenly they are morons? Explain that to me. It's unreal.
Also, a few months ago, when they started to get close to a good deal with the UFC, he realized that he could make a lot of money. The first thing he did was go to Cor Hemmers, his striking coach, and tried to renegotiate the 10% trainer's fee.
You have to understand, [a deal like Alistair's UFC contract] is a dream for trainers, because there is a possibility that they create, with the help from management of course, a fighter who can make some REAL money for them. Because let's face it, most trainers don't live in a huge house, don't drive a big car, they do it for the love of the fighter they train. They put their whole heart and soul in there.
When a fighter's lost three in a row, and there is no hope for him, the trainer is always there for him, helping him again and again, and the management is trying to find fights for him. Understand as well that trainers like Cor Hemmers and Martijn de Jong are busy with the fighter 24 hours a day. I talked to Cor in the past and he told me he couldn't sleep from all the tension, and about thinking: "What's the best game plan for Alistair?" Also know that when Alistair [first] came to Cor, when he would get hit, he would turn his back to his opponent and didn't want to fight! You saw that when he fought his first K-1 fight in Holland, it was very bad. And when he was losing, [his trainers] were the ones who convinced him to go heavyweight since he was cutting way too much [to make light-heavyweight].
PL: I guess that was when his infamous horse meat diet began, huh? (laughs)
BR: (laughs) I'm not gonna go in there, because that's never been proven and I always say "Only make comments like that if you know 100% it's true, not 99%". So anyway, [Hemmers and de Jong] put him back on track, they GAVE him all those skills, they were there from the beginning, and they build him to become the fighter he is now. So for a fighter to go in and trying to renegotiate the 10% trainer's fee is just absurd. Ask ANY trainer who has made a fighter from scratch if he would think that's good. Please let me know if you can find ONE person.
PL: You've said that Martijn de Jong is one of the people being wronged here, but I can't recall Alistair saying anything bad about him. In fact, from what I've seen it's been quite the opposite, he's been very complimentary of de Jong all through this situation.
BR: Yeah, he tries to let the rest of the world think that the coaches and other fighters are on his side, and that it's only the management he has problems with. But that is absolutely NOT the case. I mean, go to Cor Hemmers' gym and look at the posters with pictures of Alistair on there, see what his fellow fighters did to them.
And you know what he said to Martijn? I know this because I talked with Martijn personally three days ago. When he told Martijn he didn't want to pay the 10% trainer's fee--and remember, Cor and Martijn SPLIT the 10%, so it's not 20% in total--Martijn told him that he was there with him for TWELVE YEARS, and that they trained him for so long and went through the ups and downs, especially the downs. And on top of that, he said that he was Alistair's friend this whole time, and made a big contribution to Alistair's success.
But Alistair said: "Yeah, if we have to talk about people who contributed to my success, then I also have to mention my cleaning lady who cleans my house for eleven and a half Euros an hour."
OK, just think about that for a second. It's almost like it's not real. I mean, he REALLY said this! I wouldn't tell you if it wasn't the truth, you know me, Paul.
PL: Well, while I can't say that this doesn't sound shocking, in the 14 years that I've known you I've never heard you tell lies about anyone or even be accused of it.
BR: Thank you, my friend. But to continue, just the fact that he uses the words "trainer" and "cleaning lady" in the same sentence is so disrespectful. And his new offer to Martijn was LESS THAN ONE PERCENT! Plus then of course Martijn has to see if he actually gets it. I said this before--normally Golden Glory gets the money from promoters in THEIR account. THEY pay the trainers, sparring partners, the fighters and their own fee of course, and this way, everybody who needs to get paid, gets paid! Oh, and many times [Golden Glory] would pay also for extra tickets to the fight, like flights to Japan or America, for the fighter's girlfriend or other friends. They would pay their hotel room, food, everything.
When the UFC said that they wanted to give the check directly to the fighter and not to the management, I already felt the problem coming. I right away thought: "Nobody is gonna get paid". You can actually find that in my long tweet about Golden Glory in the past that many people read. I wrote it when it happened, and sure enough, that's what happened, nobody got their money.
Well, I take that back. From the first check that Alistair personally got, he did pay his trainers 1.5% instead of the 10% that they should have got! So, as example, if the 10% trainer's fee would have been $20,000, Alistair paid $2,500 and still owes $17,500. Meanwhile, the management and sparring partners never got anything at all!
And people wonder why Golden Glory wants it first in their account--well, there you have it, so that EVERYBODY who helped the fighter gets paid! They [allowed direct payment to the fighter] ONE time and it went right away wrong, also with another fighter on that card by the way, so the proof is in the pudding.
Martijn also should have gotten a percentage of the sponsor money, but didn't get anything from that as well. Needless to say, after the "cleaning lady" comment and the "less then 1%" offer, Martijn declined to be [Alistair's] trainer in the future.
Listen, if you leave your old crew, and have a NEW trainer, who comes in NOW after all the real work is done, then YES, you can make a different deal with him, which is exactly what Alistair did now. And since he knew that his management and the Golden Glory guys were not gonna take his new deal, he simply left them and came up with this whole story that's unfolding now.
And I am 100% sure, if he wanted to renegotiate the 20% management fee that he was paying before, [Golden Glory] would have done that in an instant. They would have understood that with a big contract like this, they could take a lesser fee if he really thought they didn't deserve it.
But instead he complains in public about paying 35% of his money, which is another thing! People say, "Oh, 35% is a lot of money, he shouldn't do that!" First of all, it's 30%. He ASKED to make it 35% to get a break on TAXES...but that's another crazy story. But it's 30%, ALWAYS been 30%
With my job now, any TV, movie, commercial, or whatever I do, I am out 30% right away from management, agent, and lawyer fees. But they make sure my life is good, and that I don't make a mistake, so I happily give them that money, and you know what? It's tax deductible! And another thing, EVERY actor pays the same percentage.
Alistair says he wants to come and live here in California. Really? And do WHAT after he stops fighting? What if he starts losing? Acting? TV, movies, commercials? How on earth is he gonna do that? He doesn't want to pay 30%! And these people who he has to hire, like an entertainment manager, an agent and a lawyer, who didn't even help him before now, they will still want him to pay 30%. I wonder how he's gonna justify what he's doing [to his former trainers and management] when he starts having to pay 30% to new people? Just food for thought for the future.
PL: So, going back to my original question, have you actually discussed this stuff with Alistair himself?
BR: Alistair actually called me to explain his side of the story. The only thing I told him was: "If I was you, I would read all the e-mails [that your trainers and management] send to you, because everything is in there. They did NOT try to scam you." He said: "Yeah, but there was talk about a lot of money that they would get half from." This is an outside payment, by the way, not part of his contract or a signing bonus or anything. It was supposed to go half to him, with a group of people who helped him a LOT in the past each getting a share of the other half. He said: "I found out by accident, by accident"--he said it twice--"that they would get half, and we are talking about a lot of money."
I said: "I know what money you talk about, because [Golden Glory] even told me, and they NEVER told me to not to tell you about it. So again, if I were you, I would read the e-mails, it's all in there."
But once a fighter has it in his head that he is being screwed, people around him fuel those thoughts. They say: "Yeah, don't pay 30% to the trainers, management and sparring partners. YOU made them, not the other way around." And these are people who weren't there when Alistair had his bad streak, the 5 losses in 7 fights. No, a bunch of these guys showed up when he started winning.
And if you say that many times enough to a fighter, then eventually they start thinking like that. And he actually said this to his management last month: "I made the team. Because of ME, the team is so good". Well, if he still thinks that after reading everything I just said to you, then I am actually happy that [he and Golden Glory] broke up, because that is NOT a friend or team member.
PL: How much money are we talking about?
BR: I don't wanna go there. I just talk about what I know is 100% true, because I knew this when this all happened. I don't even wanna know how much he could make, but I guess it's enough to make him turn on his friends who were there from the beginning for him, through thick and thin, ups and downs, and especially the downs.
But hey, he's not the only one, there are many fighters who, when they made the switch to the UFC, or any other organization that would pay them "real" money, suddenly left their coaches and management who were there from the beginning. I'm not gonna mention names, but there are many of them, I talked about this in the past, including two other guys from Golden Glory. My question is: where are they now? Because suddenly their careers went down, injuries started to come out of nowhere, and now it's over. They call that "karma".
The last thing I say about this: Alistair never complained before about the 30%. NEVER. Because he knew what [Golden Glory] did for him. And now when he makes it big, now suddenly it's too much? Now suddenly they don't deserve that? That's "Scrooge stuff" right there.
And you know what? He didn't make this money yet, he has to win first, and now he stepped up in the competition. The guys he beat were all let go from the UFC, which means they lost there, and now he has to fight the guys who beat his old opponents. What will he do without a team as strong as Golden Glory, who did everything for him? When everything settles down, when he starts reminiscing about the good things, and starts thinking about stuff like I just wrote about, well, good luck with the fight preparation.
OK, enough, I don't wanna talk about it anymore. For any other interviewer who reads this, this is it, nothing more, so please don't contact me...well, it depends on what's gonna be said now of course. I still have something else I might be sharing, depends on what happens. I will let you know.
But this is my side of the story and both Alistair and I know this is 100% the truth. He hurt my friends emotionally, and then on top of everything he starts writing bad about THEM?! Wow. Cor Hemmers even had to go to the hospital with heart problems TWICE since this whole thing has started, and he never had any problems like that before. And Ron Nyqvist, my good friend, was really emotional about it. He said to me: "I don't care about the money Bas, you know that, it's really not about that. He just really hurt us all. The whole team, everybody." I could hear it in his voice, it got to him, it really did, and that's why I tell you this.
PL: Wow. I'm almost out of breath after hearing all that. Bas, I can't thank you enough for your candor and your time.
BR: No problem, vato. I had to get this off my chest, it was really getting to me, but now it is out there. I will let you know if I want to say any more, but for now, I have said my piece on the matter. But if you think THIS is a lot, wait for what Golden Glory has to say, all the discussions he had with them, favors, anything, they have a lot. But that's between them, I wasn't there, so it's for them to say.
BAS RUTTEN TALKS MOVIES, TV, CHAEL SONNEN, AND ALISTAIR OVEREEM
When I scheduled an interview with former UFC and Pancrase champion "El Guapo" Bas Rutten, I expected the standard good stuff that he always provides whenever speaking with the media. Little did I realize that halfway through the interview I would step on a landmine, causing Bas to go off in a way that I've rarely heard him do in public.
PAUL LAZENBY: As a lot of your fans already know, your new movie "Here Comes The Boom" is now in post-production and will be released early next year. What can you tell us about your experience shooting it, and what can moviegoers expect?
BAS RUTTEN: It was a very cool experience. I worked with Kevin [James] before, but never like this. This is the biggest role of my career, a really big part, and it's comedy--I LOVE comedy! On top of that, I worked with Henry Winkler, "The Fonz", who I of course watched as a kid. He's a really nice guy. And Salma Hayek, well, I knew her from the movie "From Dusk Till Dawn", all the way back. Boy, did she leave an impression! (laughs). And you know what? People are going to find out she's really funny! Tough as well, very talented, she asked me every time to show her [fighting techniques], and every fighter on the set was blown away with how fast she picked things up, it was really crazy. Her father used to be a scrapper, she told me. She's hilarious. And what to expect? People can expect a really fun family movie about MMA. They will be amazed with how Kevin James looks; he moved to 218 pounds for the movie, very impressive. He moves great, watch till you see him hit the focus mitts! We just had Rich Franklin on Inside MMA and he saw Kevin hitting the mitts and was impressed, he told us.
PL: I heard that Chael Sonnen had a small role in the film. In the past he has had some derogatory things to say about you. Did that result in any tension between you two on set?
BR: Nah, I just stayed out of his way, but on his last day, when he was done with his scene, he walked with me back to my trailer. He started talking about the time that he said those things. He said: "It was a long time ago, I did stupid stuff, I don't even know why I did it" and he apologized. You know me, I'm an easy guy, and I always liked him, I really did, so it's all good. Plus, in the past, I of course said back what I wanted! For every action there is a reaction, so it's not like I didn't respond! (laughs)
PL: It was recently announced that Chael will be receiving a second shot at Anderson Silva's UFC middleweight title. He came within a hair's breadth of defeating Silva in his previous attempt, how do you think he'll fare in the rematch?
BR: Anderson is gonna be more ready now, and he better come in shape. I mean, Chael looked freaking awesome his last fight [vs. Brian Stann]! Unreal stamina, plus he finished his opponent. That's what was missing in the past, finish capability. Let's hope he puts a bag in front of a cable machine, jumps on top, grabs a handle from the cable machine, and start punching the bag, this way he strengthens his core, gets more power for his ground and pound.
PL: Your new show "Punk Payback" just launched on the FOX-owned FUEL station. What can you tell us about it?
BR: [When] a security camera picks up something bad, whether it's a robbery, purse snatch, pick pocket or car jack, anything bad, we watch the clip. [Then] I tell the people at home what the victims should have done. And then I say: "Let's see what I would do in this situation". After that, we go on a set identical to the crime scene and reenact the whole thing with me in the spot of the victim. We let the bad guy or guys...or girls, El Guapo is not a coïtusist (laughs)...we let them come in, and "dengerdedengerdedeng!" I show the people at home how to take care of that situation. It's funny, "light" presented, you know, done with a smile but the techniques I use are real. If you like the Bas Rutten Street Fighting video on YouTube, you are gonna love this.
PL: As part of the monumental deal that UFC has with the FOX network, FUEL will be airing over 2000 hours of UFC programming in 2012. What impact do you think that deal will have on the sport of MMA? Do you feel that it will benefit your show as well?
BR: It's gonna do really well for MMA, more people can see it now on a MAJOR Network, that's the key here. FOX has great programming and a huge audience. Even though you think FUEL might be different from the bigger FOX stations, you will realize it's not when you see the promotion for it on FOX, or FX, or FSN. I heard 5.7 million people watched [the "UFC on FOX" special], that's a good start! They also showed the "24/7"-looking deal that told the stories of Cain [Velasquez] and Junior [Dos Santos] before the fights happened. This way, the people at home who don't know the two headliners could get familiar with them. Very smart!
PL: A while back, this website covered the Kim Couture scandal, in which an inept referee allowed Couture to remain locked in a choke long after she had fallen unconscious. Have you seen footage of that incident, and if so, how do you feel about the Calgary Athletic Commission, which oversaw the bout, not only choosing to take no action against the ref, but also allowing him to judge at a recent event?
BR: I saw that fight, but you see this everywhere, it's insane! They should "red flag" the guy. Somebody has to make a website with the referees on there who messed up big time, this way you can keep a track record of it, and then when they did it three times, force them to do a referee course. Big John has great ones! Even better would be [to make it so] every referee needs to do a course, no matter what. If you don't, then you can't referee, period. Just like you test amateur fighters to become pro, you should do this with referees as well.
We all wanna stay away from bad outcomes, and referees should make sure that doesn't happen. Thankfully the Couture fight didn't become a tragedy, since it's very hard to kill a person with a choke. I mean, the police are even allowed to use it, and you know as well as I do, they are not supposed to do anything forceful.
PL: You recently enrolled your youngest daughter in judo classes with Olympic Bronze Medalist and current MMA fighter "Rowdy" Ronda Rousey. How did this come about, and how is your daughter liking judo?
BR: Darin Harvey, Ronda's manager, is one of my best friends. Ronda is teaching privates to a 10 years old girl and heard that my daughter Bianca was that age. You know as well as I do that it's always better to teach two people, this way you can show a technique on one person and the other one can watch, so that's when she asked if Bianca would be interested. First Bianca was not, until I told her how good Ronda was and showed her pictures of Ronda, and then [Bianca] was sold. On top of that, Ronda brought her pink gi jacket that she came out with in her last fight, and gave it to Bianca. That really sealed the deal. And Bianca loves it, she is very excited every time. Yesterday evening she was throwing me...I'm not kidding!
PL: The MMA world suffered a horrible blow last summer with the death of trainer Shawn Tompkins. Shawn was a very close friend of yours and often cited you as one of his primary influences. How has it been for you in trying to adjust to his loss?
BR: Just horrible. One of those situations that you don't really believe, you know? I talked to him two evenings before it happened. It was weird, he texted me with a problem, I felt it needed to be addressed, so thankfully I called him. He was out with his friend "Muscle Beach", and Muscle Beach was messed up. Shawn was not, but he said: "I have never left a man behind!" (laughs) We started right away messing around, and the problem never even came up. I told him I loved him, and when we hang up I received some more text messages that I answered, funny ones. It was weird, the last one said something like this: "I love you, Bas, Team Tompkins loves you, thanks for everything you have done for me." Wow--wild when you later find out this was the last message. I'm gonna miss him dearly.
PL: This December, Brock Lesnar will be returning to the Octagon after his second enforced absence due to serious intestinal problems. This time he had a section of his colon removed, but states that he's now 100%. Do you think that that's true, or will his health issues continue to compromise his performance?
BR: I hope not, he's gonna have a tough opponent. Brock is one of those guys who take training to the next level. I hear he is doing really good and surprising people at his gym, really getting much better. No secret here, he needs this fight on the ground!
PL: Strikeforce, K-1 and Dream champion (and your fellow countryman) Alistair Overeem will be battling Lesnar on December 30th with a UFC world title shot at stake. There has been a lot going on with Overeem lately, including the shocking news that Alistair was leaving the Golden Glory team and firing his managers. Have you discussed any of this with him, maybe found out his reasons for doing it?
BR: Oh no, you didn't go there! (laughs) I thought that if nobody asks, I won't say anything, but now that you ask me I have to! It's been bothering me a lot! OK, here I go.
It's a money thing. He simply doesn't want to pay the people who made him. When he lost three fights in a row...well, like pretty much 5, I mean, he lost, won, lost three times in a row, won, and lost again...and nobody wanted to have him.
But his management kept pushing and using the power that they have because they have other great fighters. Like, for example [they would say]: "If you want Semmy Schilt to fight, then you have to take Alistair as well."
It's funny how fighters think. When it goes bad with them, their team is everything to them, and they love their team. In interviews after they win a fight, they say: "I owe everything to my team". Then when the management starts to put great fights together for them, directing their careers and the fighter gets better and better, some of them simply can't handle it, and it gets to their head.
I had a bad feeling already when he called himself, after he won the K-1 Grand Prix, a "legend". He actually said in an interview right after he won: "I am a legend now". I don't think a fighter can ever make that comment about himself.
And talking about the Grand Prix, let's face it, he had a great deal of luck as well there. He fought Peter Aerts who had a WAR with Semmy Schilt [previously that night] and was completely banged up, and then he fought [Gokhan] Saki, who had a broken arm AND hand, in the finals! At that moment when you win, you should say: "I'm very happy with the result, the stars were in line for me tonight, I also got a little bit of luck". Because everybody is going to say that about you anyway, you might as well simply say it yourself to keep the people respecting you, but NOT: "I'm a legend".
PL: Wow, sounds like you're genuinely pissed off at Alistair about this.
BR: Of course, I see it too many times. I KNOW what Golden Glory did for him. He couldn't punch or kick when he came to them, and I mean, HE COULDN'T PUNCH OR KICK! Some fighters get big and then forget who was fighting for them when they were losing. Two months ago, he wanted to make a belt for the Golden Glory team with "FOR CHAMPION MANAGEMENT" engraved on it. Those were HIS words after they made this huge contract for him, and now he says they are morons? He used them to negotiate the best deal and when they did it, now suddenly they are morons? Explain that to me. It's unreal.
Also, a few months ago, when they started to get close to a good deal with the UFC, he realized that he could make a lot of money. The first thing he did was go to Cor Hemmers, his striking coach, and tried to renegotiate the 10% trainer's fee.
You have to understand, [a deal like Alistair's UFC contract] is a dream for trainers, because there is a possibility that they create, with the help from management of course, a fighter who can make some REAL money for them. Because let's face it, most trainers don't live in a huge house, don't drive a big car, they do it for the love of the fighter they train. They put their whole heart and soul in there.
When a fighter's lost three in a row, and there is no hope for him, the trainer is always there for him, helping him again and again, and the management is trying to find fights for him. Understand as well that trainers like Cor Hemmers and Martijn de Jong are busy with the fighter 24 hours a day. I talked to Cor in the past and he told me he couldn't sleep from all the tension, and about thinking: "What's the best game plan for Alistair?" Also know that when Alistair [first] came to Cor, when he would get hit, he would turn his back to his opponent and didn't want to fight! You saw that when he fought his first K-1 fight in Holland, it was very bad. And when he was losing, [his trainers] were the ones who convinced him to go heavyweight since he was cutting way too much [to make light-heavyweight].
PL: I guess that was when his infamous horse meat diet began, huh? (laughs)
BR: (laughs) I'm not gonna go in there, because that's never been proven and I always say "Only make comments like that if you know 100% it's true, not 99%". So anyway, [Hemmers and de Jong] put him back on track, they GAVE him all those skills, they were there from the beginning, and they build him to become the fighter he is now. So for a fighter to go in and trying to renegotiate the 10% trainer's fee is just absurd. Ask ANY trainer who has made a fighter from scratch if he would think that's good. Please let me know if you can find ONE person.
PL: You've said that Martijn de Jong is one of the people being wronged here, but I can't recall Alistair saying anything bad about him. In fact, from what I've seen it's been quite the opposite, he's been very complimentary of de Jong all through this situation.
BR: Yeah, he tries to let the rest of the world think that the coaches and other fighters are on his side, and that it's only the management he has problems with. But that is absolutely NOT the case. I mean, go to Cor Hemmers' gym and look at the posters with pictures of Alistair on there, see what his fellow fighters did to them.
And you know what he said to Martijn? I know this because I talked with Martijn personally three days ago. When he told Martijn he didn't want to pay the 10% trainer's fee--and remember, Cor and Martijn SPLIT the 10%, so it's not 20% in total--Martijn told him that he was there with him for TWELVE YEARS, and that they trained him for so long and went through the ups and downs, especially the downs. And on top of that, he said that he was Alistair's friend this whole time, and made a big contribution to Alistair's success.
But Alistair said: "Yeah, if we have to talk about people who contributed to my success, then I also have to mention my cleaning lady who cleans my house for eleven and a half Euros an hour."
OK, just think about that for a second. It's almost like it's not real. I mean, he REALLY said this! I wouldn't tell you if it wasn't the truth, you know me, Paul.
PL: Well, while I can't say that this doesn't sound shocking, in the 14 years that I've known you I've never heard you tell lies about anyone or even be accused of it.
BR: Thank you, my friend. But to continue, just the fact that he uses the words "trainer" and "cleaning lady" in the same sentence is so disrespectful. And his new offer to Martijn was LESS THAN ONE PERCENT! Plus then of course Martijn has to see if he actually gets it. I said this before--normally Golden Glory gets the money from promoters in THEIR account. THEY pay the trainers, sparring partners, the fighters and their own fee of course, and this way, everybody who needs to get paid, gets paid! Oh, and many times [Golden Glory] would pay also for extra tickets to the fight, like flights to Japan or America, for the fighter's girlfriend or other friends. They would pay their hotel room, food, everything.
When the UFC said that they wanted to give the check directly to the fighter and not to the management, I already felt the problem coming. I right away thought: "Nobody is gonna get paid". You can actually find that in my long tweet about Golden Glory in the past that many people read. I wrote it when it happened, and sure enough, that's what happened, nobody got their money.
Well, I take that back. From the first check that Alistair personally got, he did pay his trainers 1.5% instead of the 10% that they should have got! So, as example, if the 10% trainer's fee would have been $20,000, Alistair paid $2,500 and still owes $17,500. Meanwhile, the management and sparring partners never got anything at all!
And people wonder why Golden Glory wants it first in their account--well, there you have it, so that EVERYBODY who helped the fighter gets paid! They [allowed direct payment to the fighter] ONE time and it went right away wrong, also with another fighter on that card by the way, so the proof is in the pudding.
Martijn also should have gotten a percentage of the sponsor money, but didn't get anything from that as well. Needless to say, after the "cleaning lady" comment and the "less then 1%" offer, Martijn declined to be [Alistair's] trainer in the future.
Listen, if you leave your old crew, and have a NEW trainer, who comes in NOW after all the real work is done, then YES, you can make a different deal with him, which is exactly what Alistair did now. And since he knew that his management and the Golden Glory guys were not gonna take his new deal, he simply left them and came up with this whole story that's unfolding now.
And I am 100% sure, if he wanted to renegotiate the 20% management fee that he was paying before, [Golden Glory] would have done that in an instant. They would have understood that with a big contract like this, they could take a lesser fee if he really thought they didn't deserve it.
But instead he complains in public about paying 35% of his money, which is another thing! People say, "Oh, 35% is a lot of money, he shouldn't do that!" First of all, it's 30%. He ASKED to make it 35% to get a break on TAXES...but that's another crazy story. But it's 30%, ALWAYS been 30%
With my job now, any TV, movie, commercial, or whatever I do, I am out 30% right away from management, agent, and lawyer fees. But they make sure my life is good, and that I don't make a mistake, so I happily give them that money, and you know what? It's tax deductible! And another thing, EVERY actor pays the same percentage.
Alistair says he wants to come and live here in California. Really? And do WHAT after he stops fighting? What if he starts losing? Acting? TV, movies, commercials? How on earth is he gonna do that? He doesn't want to pay 30%! And these people who he has to hire, like an entertainment manager, an agent and a lawyer, who didn't even help him before now, they will still want him to pay 30%. I wonder how he's gonna justify what he's doing [to his former trainers and management] when he starts having to pay 30% to new people? Just food for thought for the future.
PL: So, going back to my original question, have you actually discussed this stuff with Alistair himself?
BR: Alistair actually called me to explain his side of the story. The only thing I told him was: "If I was you, I would read all the e-mails [that your trainers and management] send to you, because everything is in there. They did NOT try to scam you." He said: "Yeah, but there was talk about a lot of money that they would get half from." This is an outside payment, by the way, not part of his contract or a signing bonus or anything. It was supposed to go half to him, with a group of people who helped him a LOT in the past each getting a share of the other half. He said: "I found out by accident, by accident"--he said it twice--"that they would get half, and we are talking about a lot of money."
I said: "I know what money you talk about, because [Golden Glory] even told me, and they NEVER told me to not to tell you about it. So again, if I were you, I would read the e-mails, it's all in there."
But once a fighter has it in his head that he is being screwed, people around him fuel those thoughts. They say: "Yeah, don't pay 30% to the trainers, management and sparring partners. YOU made them, not the other way around." And these are people who weren't there when Alistair had his bad streak, the 5 losses in 7 fights. No, a bunch of these guys showed up when he started winning.
And if you say that many times enough to a fighter, then eventually they start thinking like that. And he actually said this to his management last month: "I made the team. Because of ME, the team is so good". Well, if he still thinks that after reading everything I just said to you, then I am actually happy that [he and Golden Glory] broke up, because that is NOT a friend or team member.
PL: How much money are we talking about?
BR: I don't wanna go there. I just talk about what I know is 100% true, because I knew this when this all happened. I don't even wanna know how much he could make, but I guess it's enough to make him turn on his friends who were there from the beginning for him, through thick and thin, ups and downs, and especially the downs.
But hey, he's not the only one, there are many fighters who, when they made the switch to the UFC, or any other organization that would pay them "real" money, suddenly left their coaches and management who were there from the beginning. I'm not gonna mention names, but there are many of them, I talked about this in the past, including two other guys from Golden Glory. My question is: where are they now? Because suddenly their careers went down, injuries started to come out of nowhere, and now it's over. They call that "karma".
The last thing I say about this: Alistair never complained before about the 30%. NEVER. Because he knew what [Golden Glory] did for him. And now when he makes it big, now suddenly it's too much? Now suddenly they don't deserve that? That's "Scrooge stuff" right there.
And you know what? He didn't make this money yet, he has to win first, and now he stepped up in the competition. The guys he beat were all let go from the UFC, which means they lost there, and now he has to fight the guys who beat his old opponents. What will he do without a team as strong as Golden Glory, who did everything for him? When everything settles down, when he starts reminiscing about the good things, and starts thinking about stuff like I just wrote about, well, good luck with the fight preparation.
OK, enough, I don't wanna talk about it anymore. For any other interviewer who reads this, this is it, nothing more, so please don't contact me...well, it depends on what's gonna be said now of course. I still have something else I might be sharing, depends on what happens. I will let you know.
But this is my side of the story and both Alistair and I know this is 100% the truth. He hurt my friends emotionally, and then on top of everything he starts writing bad about THEM?! Wow. Cor Hemmers even had to go to the hospital with heart problems TWICE since this whole thing has started, and he never had any problems like that before. And Ron Nyqvist, my good friend, was really emotional about it. He said to me: "I don't care about the money Bas, you know that, it's really not about that. He just really hurt us all. The whole team, everybody." I could hear it in his voice, it got to him, it really did, and that's why I tell you this.
PL: Wow. I'm almost out of breath after hearing all that. Bas, I can't thank you enough for your candor and your time.
BR: No problem, vato. I had to get this off my chest, it was really getting to me, but now it is out there. I will let you know if I want to say any more, but for now, I have said my piece on the matter. But if you think THIS is a lot, wait for what Golden Glory has to say, all the discussions he had with them, favors, anything, they have a lot. But that's between them, I wasn't there, so it's for them to say.
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Klopt ik heb het gelezen..Heb Bas Rutten erg hoog zitten en had al wat verhalen gelezen en eea ook met wat "insiders" over gehad natuurlijk. Ik volg Overeem al jaren en al jaren heb ik gehoopt dat we hem in de ufc te zien zouden krijgen maar dit overschaduwd de boel wel zeg. En als er maar een fractie waar van is dan baal ik daar eigenlijk wel van. Hoopte eigenlijk dat er veel van gelul zou zijn, vooral de vergelijking dat Martijn de Jong in 1 adem met Overeem z'n schoonmaakster werd vergeleken. Maargoed...we weten het fijne er niet van en ik ga er het liefst van uit dat Overeem op de 1 of andere manier niet anders kon dan het team verlaten waar hij samen groot mee is geworden en dat er een plausible reden is om, nu er gecashed kan worden voor IEDEREEN, zo te handelen.
Edit...Lees net op mixfight de reaktie van ELdar op Bas Rutten.
---------- Post toegevoegd Wed 16 Nov 2011 om 19:01 ----------
De andere kant van het verhaal rond Alistair en GG
Ik had me voorgenomen niet te reageren op alle aantijgingen die aan Alistair’s adres waren gedaan de laatste paar dagen door de mensen van en rond GG. Mijn handen jeukten om te reageren want het meeste is gewoon niet waar. Ik reis sinds 2004 af en aan mee met Alistair en GG als filmmaker. De afgelopen 3 jaar non stop en was met Alistair rond de contractonderhandelingen bij de UFC en heb er met hem veel over gesproken. GG was er niet, Bas Rutten ook niet. Ik wel. Ik ben kritisch naar Alistair toe en slik echt niet alles voor zoete koek. Mensen die me kennen weten dat. In zijn versie van het verhaal geef ik hem het voordeel van de twijfel en gezien de reacties vanuit GG word dat gevoel alleen maar versterkt.
Toen de shitstorm een beetje was gaan liggen nu ik net terug ben in Nederland dacht ik laat maar... Maar nu ik de reactie van Bas Rutten lees kan ik niet anders dan het een en ander proberen recht te zetten, want wat hier gebeurd klopt gewoon niet
Dus pak een biertje, zakje chips of kopie koffie, want ik zal proberen uit te leggen wat hier echt aan de hand is.
Laat ik bij het begin beginnen, Alistair’s verklaring in de laatste aflevering van “The Reem”.
Aangezien ik Golden Glory en hun vechters altijd een warm hart toe heb gedragen heb ik in de online docu “The Reem” altijd zoveel mogelijk aandacht ook aan hen willen geven. Alistair’s breuk met het team waar hij al zo lang mee was moest in mijn ogen behandeld worden en hij stemde daarmee in. We hebben de aflevering gebruikt om Alistair zijn kant van het verhaal laten vertellen. Daarin stelt hij dat Golden Glory bij de contractonderhandelingen met de UFC niet helemaal eerlijk is geweest en dat er iets in zijn nadeel en hun voordeel was opgenomen in het contract buiten zijn kennis om en dat dat zijn reden was voor het opzeggen van het vertrouwen in het management van Golden Glory.
Een logische reactie vanuit Golden Glory zou geweest zijn om die claim te weerleggen, dan zuiver je middels een simpel persbericht zo je naam. Als een management beschuldigd word van het in het nadeel stellen van een van hun vechters, dan wil je dat rechtzetten lijkt me. Op het forum zou je daar ook inhoudelijk op in kunnen gaan om die claim te weerleggen.
Een (officiele) reactie bleef helaas uit, in plaats daarvan werd er een laster campagne op touw gezet waar iedereen van heeft kunnen genieten de laatste week. Ik vind het betreurenswaardig dat verschillende mensen en Bas Rutten zich daarvoor lenen. Ik zal dat later onderbouwen.
Nergens word namelijk inhoudelijk ingegaan op de reden die Alistair heeft aangegeven en sterkt mij in de gedachte dat Alistair’s kant van het verhaal klopt en dat hij de juiste keuze heeft gemaakt te vertrekken bij Golden Glory. Ik ben net terug uit Amerika waar ik de laatste 2 weken bij hem ben geweest voor opnames van een nieuwe episode. Het niveau van de UFC is hoog en professioneel en daar is in mijn ogen geen ruimte voor de onprofessionele houding die Golden Glory hier laat zien, zeker als je wilt blijven presteren op het hoogste niveau en ook nu de UFC aansluiting zoekt bij de mainstream in Amerika.
Voorafgaand aan het interview met Alistair voor The Reem heb ik contact gezocht met martijn en hem de kans gegeven om hem te reageren en ook Golden Glory te laten weten dat ik Alistairs kant van het verhaal zou behandelen in de aankomende episode. Het was net gebeurd en het was nog te pijnlijk voor martijn om er op camera over te hebben en daar heb ik volledig begrip voor. Ik heb hem nog gemeld dat als Golden Glory hun kant van het verhaal wil vertellen dat ik daar open voor sta.
Ook heb ik Martijns kant van het verhaal aangehoord als het gaat om de breuk met de trainers en dat kwam overeen met wat Alistair heeft verklaard in de laatste episode. Er is wederhoor gepleegd als het gaat om wat Alistair verklaard aangaande dat onderdeel en dat wil ik benadrukken. Dat ze er financieel niet uitkwamen noemde martijn als laatste maar was niet de hoofdreden dat Alistair niet verder kon met Cor en Martijn.
Vanuit het kamp van GG word telkens het verhaal van de schoonmaakster aangehaald. Dat is een knap staaltje manipulatie van hun kant en ik zal uitleggen waarom. Alistair heeft de afgelopen jaren zelf stevig geïnvesteerd in zijn eigen team, mede omdat GG veel niet oppakte waar hij om vroeg. Hij heeft toen zelf mensen benaderd waaronder mijzelf en betaalde iedereen uit eigen zak. We zijn toen begonnen met The Reem, een nieuwe site, kledinglijn, twitter, facebook en hebben contacten aangehaald met populaire blogs en journalisten als Ariel Helwani. Dit alles buiten GG om. Sportief heeft Alistair zelf zijn eigen fysiotherapeut, dietist en sparringpartners gehaald voor het MMA gedeelte. Hij betaald ook de kost en inwoning voor de sparringpartners die hij uit het buitenland haalt. Er is dus een heel team die werkt aan het succes van Alistair Overeem, de trainers, de sparringpartners die zijn klappen opvangen, ik als filmmaker maar ook zijn schoonmaakster thuis. Iedereen is een puzzelstukje in de puzzel die uiteindelijk Alistair Overeem is. Alistair ziet dat en heeft dat geprobeerd uit te leggen aan zijn trainers, met zijn schoonmaakster als ongelukkig voorbeeld. De trainers zijn natuurlijk wel groot stuk in de puzzel en daar zouden ze ook zo voor betaald worden, maar een onderdeel net als iedereen. Dit is volledig in de communicatie vanuit GG uit zijn verband gerukt.
Alistair is vaker in het verleden bij trainers weggegaan en het klopt dat de trainers een groot aandeel hebben in de ontwikkeling en prestaties van een vechter, zij zijn daar ook altijd netjes voor beloond middels het percentage over de jaren. Ondanks dat vind ik niet dat de vechter als bezit kan worden gezien, loyaliteit is belangrijk, maar als je als vechter het gevoel hebt dat het anders en beter kan ergens anders dan moet die mogelijkheid er zijn lijkt mij.
Alle inspanningen die zijn gedaan buiten het GG management om hebben bijgedragen aan het succes van Alistair de laatste paar jaar in mijn ogen. Sportief heeft natuurlijk GG een heel belangrijk aandeel gehad met Cor, Martijn en alle vechters, maar zakelijk bleek het management diverse keren de zwakste schakel als het ging om zaken die buiten het contractuele lagen. Het blijft lastig om zo’n grote stal van vechters te begeleiden mede vanwege de situatie van Ron en het feit dat Bas in Thailand zit. Communicatie is dan vaak traag en er blijft veel liggen dat dan opgepikt moet worden door de trainers die zelf ook druk zijn.
In mijn ogen plukt het management de vruchten van het werk van velen in hun onderhandelingen met andere partijen. Ik vind het dan ook arrogant van hen om te stellen dat zij verantwoordelijk zijn voor het “Miljoenencontract”. Dit mag trouwens met een korrel zout genomen worden. Ik was bij alistair toen hij de uiteindelijke cijfers voor ogen kreeg en zijn reactie was zichtbaar teleurgesteld. Ook hij had vernomen dat het om een miljoenencontract zou gaan. Er was weinig ruimte om weer de onderhandelingen in te gaan dus na er een nachtje over geslapen te hebben was zijn reactie ook des Alistair’s: **** it, we gaan gewoon iedereen slopen en dan komt het vanzelf wel goed.
Dat hij nu afgeschilderd word als geldwolf steekt me dan ook en is in mijn ogen ook hypocriet. Hij heeft netjes het contract getekend met alle percentages van GG. Dagen na het tekenen kwam hij echter er achter dat er iets in het contract was opgenomen waar hij niks van wist. Dat heeft ervoor gezorgd dat hij het vertrouwen in het management heeft opgezegd. Daar ligt dan ook het conflict.
Omdat Alistairs percentage ongewijzigd was sinds hij als jonge jongen had getekend bij Golden Glory en hij inmiddels een team om zich heen had verzameld wat hij uit eigen zak betaalde naast de percentages die hij ook nog aan GG af droeg, vond hij dat het tijd werd om daarover rond de tafel te zitten. Hij had dit al veel eerder aangegeven bij het management zoals Cor meldde. Niet alleen zijn gage ging omhoog maar ook de verdienste van Golden Glory, vandaar dat hij graag een aantal zaken waar hij eerst zelf voor betaalde graag gecompenseerd zou willen zien met de 30% die hij het management betaald. Hij heeft inmiddels ook een andere begeleiding nodig als kampioen dan als opkomende vechter in mijn optiek. Ook het feit dat hij veel van zijn tijd in Amerika zal trainen is een factor, hij kan niet verwachten dat zijn twee Nederlandse trainers ook de helft van de tijd in Amerika gaan zitten dus een percentage was in Alistairs ogen niet meer reëel als je kosten aan training in Amerika doorlopen en de rest van je team moet onderhouden die allemaal werken voor een fixed fee. In mijn ogen moet daarover onderhandeld worden en persoonlijk weet ik dat je daar met hem altijd uitkomt als je daar goede argumenten voor hebt. Aan het eind van de dag is een goed groepsgevoel en eerlijkheid het belangrijkste in Alistair’s optiek.
Het gegeven dat Alistair een verandering wilde in percentages is iets wat langer speelde en heeft niets te maken heeft met de breuk. Dat dit vervolgens word aangehaald door Cor en daardoor door velen als feit word gebracht is dan ook beschamend. De naam van Nederlands grootste en meest succesvolle MMA vechter ooit in Nederland word hier even ter grabbel gegooid en ik vind dat mixfight onwaardig. Het mooie van de vechtsport vind ik dat je strijd kan voeren tot het bot, maar elkaar daarna een hand kan geven uit eerbied en respect. Ondanks dat je het niet met elkaar eens bent betekent nog niet dat je elkaar onder de gordel moet raken in dat is wat hier meerdere malen gebeurd. Het is jammer dat regels die op de mat gelden kennelijk niet opgaan voor het zakelijke binnen GG.
Ik wil ook nog even ingaan op het stukje op TMZ wat ook aangehaald word door Bas Rutten. Alistair heeft nooit “My management are morons” gezegd en is verzonnen door de site zelf. TMZ is een roddelsite en net als de Prive dikken ze verhalen aan. Ze hebben iemand bij de rechtbank zitten die door de publieke records gaat en die hebben het er uit gepikt toen Alistair de rechtzaak aanging met GG. Wij waren in Amerika net zo verrast als iedereen toen dit op mixfight verscheen. De opmerking Mickey Mouse management waar over word gevallen was een grapje als je het interview terugkijkt, en staat niet in verhouding met de zaken die GG nu naar buiten brengt. Zeker een stoer vechtteam als GG zou het sieren een wat dikkere huid te hebben dan daar een punt van te maken.
Over Bas Rutten wil ik het volgende kwijt. Ik heb Bas in hoog aanzien staan en vind hem een held. Wat me wel opviel bij de diverse keren dat ik hem voor de camera had is dat hij onvoorwaardelijk aan de kant van GG staat. Niks mis mee op zich maar het is nooit objectief, dat maakt hem als bron ongeloofwaardig vind ik. Ik heb hem kort geïnterviewd voor Alistairs laatste gevecht tegen Werdum en heb interview bewust niet gebruikt omdat hij Alistair zo ver ophemelde dat ik het iets te overdreven vond. Hij kwam erg partijdig over en gezien zijn positie als commentator had ik het gevoel dat ik hem een beetje tegen zichzelf moest beschermen. Ik zal kijken of ik dat interview alsnog kan posten.
Het liefst blijf ik buiten discussies als deze en het is me ook afgeraden. Maar Alistair is een goede vriend die publiekelijk word afgemaakt op dit moment. Net als dat er mensen zijn die opkomen voor Golden Glory doe ik dat voor Alistair. Voor je vrienden kom je op, maakt me niet uit wat de consequenties zijn. Ik sta open voor een gezonde discussie op de punten die ik hier aangeef en hoop dat dat we de discussie rond deze soap op een respectabele manier kunnen voortzetten.
Groeten !
Eldar Gross
Maker van “The Reem”
Edit...Lees net op mixfight de reaktie van ELdar op Bas Rutten.
---------- Post toegevoegd Wed 16 Nov 2011 om 19:01 ----------
De andere kant van het verhaal rond Alistair en GG
Ik had me voorgenomen niet te reageren op alle aantijgingen die aan Alistair’s adres waren gedaan de laatste paar dagen door de mensen van en rond GG. Mijn handen jeukten om te reageren want het meeste is gewoon niet waar. Ik reis sinds 2004 af en aan mee met Alistair en GG als filmmaker. De afgelopen 3 jaar non stop en was met Alistair rond de contractonderhandelingen bij de UFC en heb er met hem veel over gesproken. GG was er niet, Bas Rutten ook niet. Ik wel. Ik ben kritisch naar Alistair toe en slik echt niet alles voor zoete koek. Mensen die me kennen weten dat. In zijn versie van het verhaal geef ik hem het voordeel van de twijfel en gezien de reacties vanuit GG word dat gevoel alleen maar versterkt.
Toen de shitstorm een beetje was gaan liggen nu ik net terug ben in Nederland dacht ik laat maar... Maar nu ik de reactie van Bas Rutten lees kan ik niet anders dan het een en ander proberen recht te zetten, want wat hier gebeurd klopt gewoon niet
Dus pak een biertje, zakje chips of kopie koffie, want ik zal proberen uit te leggen wat hier echt aan de hand is.
Laat ik bij het begin beginnen, Alistair’s verklaring in de laatste aflevering van “The Reem”.
Aangezien ik Golden Glory en hun vechters altijd een warm hart toe heb gedragen heb ik in de online docu “The Reem” altijd zoveel mogelijk aandacht ook aan hen willen geven. Alistair’s breuk met het team waar hij al zo lang mee was moest in mijn ogen behandeld worden en hij stemde daarmee in. We hebben de aflevering gebruikt om Alistair zijn kant van het verhaal laten vertellen. Daarin stelt hij dat Golden Glory bij de contractonderhandelingen met de UFC niet helemaal eerlijk is geweest en dat er iets in zijn nadeel en hun voordeel was opgenomen in het contract buiten zijn kennis om en dat dat zijn reden was voor het opzeggen van het vertrouwen in het management van Golden Glory.
Een logische reactie vanuit Golden Glory zou geweest zijn om die claim te weerleggen, dan zuiver je middels een simpel persbericht zo je naam. Als een management beschuldigd word van het in het nadeel stellen van een van hun vechters, dan wil je dat rechtzetten lijkt me. Op het forum zou je daar ook inhoudelijk op in kunnen gaan om die claim te weerleggen.
Een (officiele) reactie bleef helaas uit, in plaats daarvan werd er een laster campagne op touw gezet waar iedereen van heeft kunnen genieten de laatste week. Ik vind het betreurenswaardig dat verschillende mensen en Bas Rutten zich daarvoor lenen. Ik zal dat later onderbouwen.
Nergens word namelijk inhoudelijk ingegaan op de reden die Alistair heeft aangegeven en sterkt mij in de gedachte dat Alistair’s kant van het verhaal klopt en dat hij de juiste keuze heeft gemaakt te vertrekken bij Golden Glory. Ik ben net terug uit Amerika waar ik de laatste 2 weken bij hem ben geweest voor opnames van een nieuwe episode. Het niveau van de UFC is hoog en professioneel en daar is in mijn ogen geen ruimte voor de onprofessionele houding die Golden Glory hier laat zien, zeker als je wilt blijven presteren op het hoogste niveau en ook nu de UFC aansluiting zoekt bij de mainstream in Amerika.
Voorafgaand aan het interview met Alistair voor The Reem heb ik contact gezocht met martijn en hem de kans gegeven om hem te reageren en ook Golden Glory te laten weten dat ik Alistairs kant van het verhaal zou behandelen in de aankomende episode. Het was net gebeurd en het was nog te pijnlijk voor martijn om er op camera over te hebben en daar heb ik volledig begrip voor. Ik heb hem nog gemeld dat als Golden Glory hun kant van het verhaal wil vertellen dat ik daar open voor sta.
Ook heb ik Martijns kant van het verhaal aangehoord als het gaat om de breuk met de trainers en dat kwam overeen met wat Alistair heeft verklaard in de laatste episode. Er is wederhoor gepleegd als het gaat om wat Alistair verklaard aangaande dat onderdeel en dat wil ik benadrukken. Dat ze er financieel niet uitkwamen noemde martijn als laatste maar was niet de hoofdreden dat Alistair niet verder kon met Cor en Martijn.
Vanuit het kamp van GG word telkens het verhaal van de schoonmaakster aangehaald. Dat is een knap staaltje manipulatie van hun kant en ik zal uitleggen waarom. Alistair heeft de afgelopen jaren zelf stevig geïnvesteerd in zijn eigen team, mede omdat GG veel niet oppakte waar hij om vroeg. Hij heeft toen zelf mensen benaderd waaronder mijzelf en betaalde iedereen uit eigen zak. We zijn toen begonnen met The Reem, een nieuwe site, kledinglijn, twitter, facebook en hebben contacten aangehaald met populaire blogs en journalisten als Ariel Helwani. Dit alles buiten GG om. Sportief heeft Alistair zelf zijn eigen fysiotherapeut, dietist en sparringpartners gehaald voor het MMA gedeelte. Hij betaald ook de kost en inwoning voor de sparringpartners die hij uit het buitenland haalt. Er is dus een heel team die werkt aan het succes van Alistair Overeem, de trainers, de sparringpartners die zijn klappen opvangen, ik als filmmaker maar ook zijn schoonmaakster thuis. Iedereen is een puzzelstukje in de puzzel die uiteindelijk Alistair Overeem is. Alistair ziet dat en heeft dat geprobeerd uit te leggen aan zijn trainers, met zijn schoonmaakster als ongelukkig voorbeeld. De trainers zijn natuurlijk wel groot stuk in de puzzel en daar zouden ze ook zo voor betaald worden, maar een onderdeel net als iedereen. Dit is volledig in de communicatie vanuit GG uit zijn verband gerukt.
Alistair is vaker in het verleden bij trainers weggegaan en het klopt dat de trainers een groot aandeel hebben in de ontwikkeling en prestaties van een vechter, zij zijn daar ook altijd netjes voor beloond middels het percentage over de jaren. Ondanks dat vind ik niet dat de vechter als bezit kan worden gezien, loyaliteit is belangrijk, maar als je als vechter het gevoel hebt dat het anders en beter kan ergens anders dan moet die mogelijkheid er zijn lijkt mij.
Alle inspanningen die zijn gedaan buiten het GG management om hebben bijgedragen aan het succes van Alistair de laatste paar jaar in mijn ogen. Sportief heeft natuurlijk GG een heel belangrijk aandeel gehad met Cor, Martijn en alle vechters, maar zakelijk bleek het management diverse keren de zwakste schakel als het ging om zaken die buiten het contractuele lagen. Het blijft lastig om zo’n grote stal van vechters te begeleiden mede vanwege de situatie van Ron en het feit dat Bas in Thailand zit. Communicatie is dan vaak traag en er blijft veel liggen dat dan opgepikt moet worden door de trainers die zelf ook druk zijn.
In mijn ogen plukt het management de vruchten van het werk van velen in hun onderhandelingen met andere partijen. Ik vind het dan ook arrogant van hen om te stellen dat zij verantwoordelijk zijn voor het “Miljoenencontract”. Dit mag trouwens met een korrel zout genomen worden. Ik was bij alistair toen hij de uiteindelijke cijfers voor ogen kreeg en zijn reactie was zichtbaar teleurgesteld. Ook hij had vernomen dat het om een miljoenencontract zou gaan. Er was weinig ruimte om weer de onderhandelingen in te gaan dus na er een nachtje over geslapen te hebben was zijn reactie ook des Alistair’s: **** it, we gaan gewoon iedereen slopen en dan komt het vanzelf wel goed.
Dat hij nu afgeschilderd word als geldwolf steekt me dan ook en is in mijn ogen ook hypocriet. Hij heeft netjes het contract getekend met alle percentages van GG. Dagen na het tekenen kwam hij echter er achter dat er iets in het contract was opgenomen waar hij niks van wist. Dat heeft ervoor gezorgd dat hij het vertrouwen in het management heeft opgezegd. Daar ligt dan ook het conflict.
Omdat Alistairs percentage ongewijzigd was sinds hij als jonge jongen had getekend bij Golden Glory en hij inmiddels een team om zich heen had verzameld wat hij uit eigen zak betaalde naast de percentages die hij ook nog aan GG af droeg, vond hij dat het tijd werd om daarover rond de tafel te zitten. Hij had dit al veel eerder aangegeven bij het management zoals Cor meldde. Niet alleen zijn gage ging omhoog maar ook de verdienste van Golden Glory, vandaar dat hij graag een aantal zaken waar hij eerst zelf voor betaalde graag gecompenseerd zou willen zien met de 30% die hij het management betaald. Hij heeft inmiddels ook een andere begeleiding nodig als kampioen dan als opkomende vechter in mijn optiek. Ook het feit dat hij veel van zijn tijd in Amerika zal trainen is een factor, hij kan niet verwachten dat zijn twee Nederlandse trainers ook de helft van de tijd in Amerika gaan zitten dus een percentage was in Alistairs ogen niet meer reëel als je kosten aan training in Amerika doorlopen en de rest van je team moet onderhouden die allemaal werken voor een fixed fee. In mijn ogen moet daarover onderhandeld worden en persoonlijk weet ik dat je daar met hem altijd uitkomt als je daar goede argumenten voor hebt. Aan het eind van de dag is een goed groepsgevoel en eerlijkheid het belangrijkste in Alistair’s optiek.
Het gegeven dat Alistair een verandering wilde in percentages is iets wat langer speelde en heeft niets te maken heeft met de breuk. Dat dit vervolgens word aangehaald door Cor en daardoor door velen als feit word gebracht is dan ook beschamend. De naam van Nederlands grootste en meest succesvolle MMA vechter ooit in Nederland word hier even ter grabbel gegooid en ik vind dat mixfight onwaardig. Het mooie van de vechtsport vind ik dat je strijd kan voeren tot het bot, maar elkaar daarna een hand kan geven uit eerbied en respect. Ondanks dat je het niet met elkaar eens bent betekent nog niet dat je elkaar onder de gordel moet raken in dat is wat hier meerdere malen gebeurd. Het is jammer dat regels die op de mat gelden kennelijk niet opgaan voor het zakelijke binnen GG.
Ik wil ook nog even ingaan op het stukje op TMZ wat ook aangehaald word door Bas Rutten. Alistair heeft nooit “My management are morons” gezegd en is verzonnen door de site zelf. TMZ is een roddelsite en net als de Prive dikken ze verhalen aan. Ze hebben iemand bij de rechtbank zitten die door de publieke records gaat en die hebben het er uit gepikt toen Alistair de rechtzaak aanging met GG. Wij waren in Amerika net zo verrast als iedereen toen dit op mixfight verscheen. De opmerking Mickey Mouse management waar over word gevallen was een grapje als je het interview terugkijkt, en staat niet in verhouding met de zaken die GG nu naar buiten brengt. Zeker een stoer vechtteam als GG zou het sieren een wat dikkere huid te hebben dan daar een punt van te maken.
Over Bas Rutten wil ik het volgende kwijt. Ik heb Bas in hoog aanzien staan en vind hem een held. Wat me wel opviel bij de diverse keren dat ik hem voor de camera had is dat hij onvoorwaardelijk aan de kant van GG staat. Niks mis mee op zich maar het is nooit objectief, dat maakt hem als bron ongeloofwaardig vind ik. Ik heb hem kort geïnterviewd voor Alistairs laatste gevecht tegen Werdum en heb interview bewust niet gebruikt omdat hij Alistair zo ver ophemelde dat ik het iets te overdreven vond. Hij kwam erg partijdig over en gezien zijn positie als commentator had ik het gevoel dat ik hem een beetje tegen zichzelf moest beschermen. Ik zal kijken of ik dat interview alsnog kan posten.
Het liefst blijf ik buiten discussies als deze en het is me ook afgeraden. Maar Alistair is een goede vriend die publiekelijk word afgemaakt op dit moment. Net als dat er mensen zijn die opkomen voor Golden Glory doe ik dat voor Alistair. Voor je vrienden kom je op, maakt me niet uit wat de consequenties zijn. Ik sta open voor een gezonde discussie op de punten die ik hier aangeef en hoop dat dat we de discussie rond deze soap op een respectabele manier kunnen voortzetten.
Groeten !
Eldar Gross
Maker van “The Reem”
Laatst bewerkt:
Soesoeki
Dutch Bodybuilder
- Lid sinds
- 16 okt 2010
- Berichten
- 479
- Waardering
- 22
- Lengte
- 1m88
- Massa
- 83kg
- Vetpercentage
- 21%
Het zou mij erg tegenvallen van Overeem als het klopt ... al ken ik de man natuurlijk niet persoonlijk en ben geen bekende in de vechtwereld ofzo. Maar hij lijkt mij ook weer erg sterk als een Bas Rutten dit uit zijn duim zuigt.
Gadver ... dit is wel een smet op een grote Nederlandse vechter in het UFC ( ja er is nog een grote, maar dat is meer een lange ).
Gadver ... dit is wel een smet op een grote Nederlandse vechter in het UFC ( ja er is nog een grote, maar dat is meer een lange ).
Soesoeki
Dutch Bodybuilder
- Lid sinds
- 16 okt 2010
- Berichten
- 479
- Waardering
- 22
- Lengte
- 1m88
- Massa
- 83kg
- Vetpercentage
- 21%
Ik hoop in ieder geval dat deze hele soap A.O. niet te veel van zijn doel afleidt ... namelijk Lesnar verslaan en een HW Champion worden
- Lid sinds
- 16 nov 2006
- Berichten
- 11.657
- Waardering
- 2.909
- Lengte
- 1m86
- Massa
- 102kg
Zullen we waarschijnlijk nooit weten.
- Lid sinds
- 7 jan 2011
- Berichten
- 818
- Waardering
- 53
- Lengte
- 1m80
- Massa
- 99kg
BassD
Competitive Bodybuilder
- Lid sinds
- 13 jan 2004
- Berichten
- 1.606
- Waardering
- 92
- Lengte
- 1m93
- Massa
- 119kg
- Vetpercentage
- 13%
quote:
"He said: "Yeah, but there was talk about a lot of money that they would get half from." This is an outside payment, by the way, not part of his contract or a signing bonus or anything. It was supposed to go half to him, with a group of people who helped him a LOT in the past each getting a share of the other half. He said: "I found out by accident, by accident"--he said it twice--"that they would get half, and we are talking about a lot of money."
bovenstaande is dus kennelijk de druppel geweest voor Alistair. Als het om zo'n groot bedrag gaat, waarom moet Alistair er dan per ongeluk zelf achter komen? Het zal heus wel ergens hebben gestaan (kleine lettertjes), maar dat hadden ze um best wel duidelijk mogen vertellen. Typische "management praktijken" zo te horen..
"He said: "Yeah, but there was talk about a lot of money that they would get half from." This is an outside payment, by the way, not part of his contract or a signing bonus or anything. It was supposed to go half to him, with a group of people who helped him a LOT in the past each getting a share of the other half. He said: "I found out by accident, by accident"--he said it twice--"that they would get half, and we are talking about a lot of money."
bovenstaande is dus kennelijk de druppel geweest voor Alistair. Als het om zo'n groot bedrag gaat, waarom moet Alistair er dan per ongeluk zelf achter komen? Het zal heus wel ergens hebben gestaan (kleine lettertjes), maar dat hadden ze um best wel duidelijk mogen vertellen. Typische "management praktijken" zo te horen..
- Lid sinds
- 16 nov 2006
- Berichten
- 11.657
- Waardering
- 2.909
- Lengte
- 1m86
- Massa
- 102kg
BassD
Competitive Bodybuilder
- Lid sinds
- 13 jan 2004
- Berichten
- 1.606
- Waardering
- 92
- Lengte
- 1m93
- Massa
- 119kg
- Vetpercentage
- 13%
dit is speculeren van mijn kant.. maar het zal wel iets zijn geweest als sponsoringgelden die naast het contract worden behandeld. Misschien dat we er ooit achter zullen komen, maar waarschijnlijk niet.
Ik geef het voordeel van de twijfel iig aan Alistair.. Want ik weet hoe sommige managementpraktijken kunnen zijn , zodra er groot geld mee is gemoeid. Ook hoe GG nu alle vuile was buitenhangt in de media , en aan zwartmakerij doet zonder met keiharde feiten naar buiten te komen, vind ik beneden alle peil, en zelfs verdachtmakend. Als je van jezelf weet dat je juist hebt gehandeld, dan laat je het toch lekker bepalen door de rechter, en hou je verder lekker je smoel? Alistair kan ik het niet kwalijk nemen , want dat is tenslotte "maar" een vechter, waarbij ook nog es zn hart op de tong ligt.
