Zijn er ook steroiden waarvan je groeit zonder te trainen

[LangeMan]

T zijn ook altijd dezelfde die discussie omtrent GH beginnen he LangeMan schrijft het niet alleen bij elleboogblessures voor maar nu ook al voor spierbehoud tijdens revalidatie :S Aparte mannejte, die Lange

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tja, ik lees nog eens wat

 

[LangeMan]

Let vooral op het stukje over athleten in rust en stukje over injury etc

Human Growth Hormone



(Somatotropin)


Human growth hormone is produced in the body by the pituitary gland. Before this happens, Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone (GHRH) and Somatostatin (SST) are released by the hypothalamus, and that determines whether more or less GH is produced by the pituitary.(1) Many factors influence the release of GH, however, including nutrition and exercise (6)(7).

Once it is released, Growth Hormone (GH), which is also called Somatotropin (STH) has many functions in the human body. GH is a protein that stimulates the body cells to both increase in size, as well as undergo more rapid cell division than usual. In addition, it enhances the movement of amino acids through cell membranes and also increases the rate at which these cells convert these molecules into proteins. Clearly, you can see that this would amount to an anabolic (muscle building) effect in the human body. GH also has the ability to cause cells to decrease the normal rate at which they utilize carbohydrates, and simultaneously increase the rate at which they use fats.(1) Fat loss and lean mass increases with GH have been found at a dose as low as . 0.028 iu/kg/daily for 24 weeks(4)…however, in my estimation, that would be insufficient for a bodybuilder trying to gain muscle. Lets use .028iu/kg as a working number; thats 2.8iu for a 100kg (220lbs) bodybuilder. That’s certainly not unreasonable, and I would say that that dose to 2x that dose is the range most bodybuilders and athletes are finding their best results with. Also, that length of time used in the study I just mentioned (24 weeks) is very typical of GH use, and in conversations with my friends who have used this compound, have told me that they experience consistent results starting well after the 2-month-mark, and they tend to either run this stuff for 6 months at a time, or year-round (if they have sufficient funds). One of my friends is able to consistently retain a shredded 6-7% body fat all year round with the assistance of GH, whether he is on steroids or off. He also has noted that his cardio (fast walking, for an hour a day) was much easier while on GH than when off, and certainly the research I’ve done would support his claim that submaximal aerobic ability is improved with GH use (5) (15).

How anabolic is this stuff? Well, even endurance athletes at rest (!) were observed in one study to be in an anabolic state (8). Yeah…so you can basically run marathons and take this stuff, and still build some muscle. Pretty impressive, right?

Growth Hormone is usually secreted in rhythmic pulses while you are sleeping, as two peptides, GHRH and Somatostatin (SST) are alternately released. As you can guess, GHRH (Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone) is the one responsible for the Release of Growth Hormone (And who said scientists have funny ways for naming things…?).(1)

Growth hormone also has the ability to stimulate the production (or reproduction, in the case of an injury) of cartilage. This, however, requires the presence of a mediator substance, Somatomedin (IGF), which is released from the liver in response to GH…and the IGF, in turn, actually promotes the growth of cartilage.(1)

Although it requires IGF to actually grow new cartilage, GH is directly able to stimulate the elongation of bone tissue.(1), and GH has also been shown to elicit a positive effects on erythropoeisis (9), which is great for both anabolism as well as endurance.

Remember the negative feedback loop I always tell you about? Well, of course, your body has one which can stop the secretion of GH, and it involves IGF. When your liver receives secretes IGF-1, it sends a message to both your Hypothalamus as well as your Pituitary to stop producing GH. (1)

As you have probably guessed by now, your body produces the majority of it’s GH during your early years, when you are experiencing growth spurts. As you get older, however, you just produce less of this stuff, and it’s effects are much less pronounced. This was the driving force behind the (always weird) life-extension crowd embracing GH in the early 90’s. And, as usual,. The driving force behind the athletic world embracing GH was Dan Duchaine, which I’m sure comes as no surprise to many. He first wrote a teaser about it in his Underground Steroid Handbook, and then wrote extensively about it for the next couple of decades. At that time, Grorm, was being used. This nasty stuff was GH extracted from (are you ready?): the pituitary of dead bodies. That’s real “Dawn of the Dead” style science, in my opinion. I guess it’s an advance from a couple of centuries ago, when Descartes (the “I think therefore I am” guy) declared the pituitary the part of the human body where the soul resides. Anyway, back to the cadaver-thing…the GH extracted from the cadavers were found to be able to (in rare cases) carry a rare brain disease. This of course, infected the kids who received the infected GH. The use of GH from cadavers was subsequently discontinued. Back then (the 80’s) there was also a fake version of some purple looking GH going around (it was HCG I believe, mixed with [Link niet meer beschikbaar][/url]) called “Rhesus Monkey Growth Hormone”…which is pretty funny, looking back on it. To this day, however, if you get fake GH, it’s still probably HCG, since both come presented as a powder and bacterioistatic water you need to use to reconstitute it (and then it needs to be refrigerated).

Even if you are using the non-cadaver-derived stuff (and at this point, I’m 100% sure that there’s none of the old Grorm left on shelves anywhere), it’s possible that you experience some side effects like carpal tunnel syndrome, acromegaly (a thickening or growth of bones, most noticeable in the feet, hands, and forehead), and enlarged organs. Gynocomastia is also possible as a side effect of GH use, as well as Fluid retention(16) (the later being initially pointed out to me by a female colleague who had a pre-contest bodybuilder using GH as part of his contest prep).

Now for some really interesting stuff:

Although GH can easily produce very nice, high quality weight and muscle gains, it’s a very poor compound for inducing strength gains(2)(3)(4). That’s very counterintuitive, and certainly many strength athletes have experienced great results in both strength as well as muscle size and fatloss from GH. Generally, many studies have focused on GH vs. GH and exercise, and without the exercise LBM increases but not usually maximum voluntary strength output. It should also be noted that most athletes utilizing GH are using it in a “cocktail” with (at least) anabolic steroids, and usually with IGF, thyroid meds, and other goodies such as an [Link niet meer beschikbaar] Inhibitor.

Lets discuss exactly why this is.

Most people who are taking the plunge into GH use have reached a dead end with their use of anabolics, and need to push through that wall. I’m sure you’ve heard about the synergistic combination of using GH along with Anabolic Steroids, IGF, insulin and [Link niet meer beschikbaar] (* usually synthroid, a thyroid medication). The reason is that when these hormones are used correctly together, they'll produce a large amount of synergy…the insulin is able to shuttle nutrients into your muscle, the thyroid hormone increases your fat-burning capability, the IGF will cause muscle growth as well as helping to grow new cartilage (thus preventing injury), and the anabolic steroids like testosterone, specifically (in addition to being anabolic) can increase IGF-1, in muscle tissue(11), and maybe even increase your body’s ability to use it. Also, usually, an increased amount of IGF usually tells your body to stop producing GH…but testosterone actually blunts this part of the Negative FeedBack Loop (12)! And the addition of an [Link niet meer beschikbaar] Inhibitor will also stop conversion of testosterone into [Link niet meer beschikbaar]; [Link niet meer beschikbaar] reduces IGF levels.(13)(14) Finally, the GH does …well everything I just spent the last few pages telling you about!
Thus, IGF, Testosterone (and of course other steroids), Insulin, thyroid meds, and GH will all combine to produce a pretty damned effective fat-burning and muscle building cycle! You know what else? GH is virtually undetectable on any sort of currently used drug-screening tests. GH, Insulin, Thyroid meds, and IGF may also be used pretty safely by those who may be subject to drug screening tests, or as a non-HPTA suppressive “bridge” between cycles.

Finally, I’ll tell you how I’d take GH, personally. There was a study done on continuous GH use vs. every other day injections (ED vs. EOD for the sake of brevity), with a equal total weekly dose. Although it’s counterintuitive, every other day injections produced better total growth in the kids in this (2 and 4 year long) study. Take a look at these graphs:

[Afbeelding niet meer beschikbaar]
Growth velocity of children treated with alternate day GH (the darker bars) or with a daily GH regimen before, during, and 2 yr after stopping therapy. Values are the mean ± SD. *, P < 0.05; **, P < 0.01.(10)


Here’s another:

[Afbeelding niet meer beschikbaar]
Pretreatment and cumulative 4-yr growth velocity of children treated with alternate day GH ( the darker bars) or with a daily GH regimen. Values are the mean ± SD. *, P < 0.00 (10)

Shooting GH every other day more accurately replicates the pulsile frequency of GH, and thus gave better results for growth (height) deficient children… GH pulsatility is necessary for proper function of the GH receptor.(10) Dosing in the EOD nature reduces incidence of any sort of withdrawal problems associated with normal GH use, including regression or retardation of growth after cessation of therapy.

Therefore, I feel very comfortable speculating that the use of GH in this manner, which more closely simulates the natural secretion pattern of it, allows the GH receptors and the rest of the body to to more efficiently recover from it, and this will result in much more muscle growth over time (although height was examined in the previous study). My recommendations, therefore are 2 shots per day of .028iu/kg of bodyweight, taken every other day, for a minimum of 3months, and preferably for 2-3x that long….and preferably with the other synergistic compounds we’ve just taken a look at.

You should be paying between $1.75-2.75 per IU of GH, and since you are going to (necessarily) be buying it in bulk, you should be paying closer to the lower end of that.



References:

1. Human Anatomy and Physiology, 6th Edition, John W. Hole jr.
2. J Appl Physiol 94: 2273-2281, 2003. First published February 14, 2003; doi:10.1152
3. Journal of Applied Physiology, Vol 77, Issue 1 23-29,
4. EFFECTS OF RECOMBINANT GROWTH HORMONE ON VISCERAL FAT ACCUMULATION: PILOT STUDY IN HIV-INFECTED ADOLESCENTS.
J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2005 Apr 19; [Epub ahead of print]
5. Measures of submaximal aerobic performance evaluate and predict functional response to growth hormone (GH) treatment in GH-deficient adults. J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 1999 Dec;84(12):4570-7.
6. Hormonal responses to consecutive days of heavy-resistance exercise with or without nutritional supplementation. J Appl Physiol, Oct 1998; 85: 1544 - 1555.
7. Hormonal and growth factor responses to heavy resistance exercise protocols
J Appl Physiol, Oct 1990; 69: 1442 – 1450
8. High dose growth hormone exerts an anabolic effect at rest and during exercise in endurance-trained athletes.J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2003 Nov;88(11):5221-6.
9. Christ ER, Cummings MH, Westwood NB, Sawyer BM, Pearson TC, Sonksen PH, Russell-Jones DL. The importance of growth hormone in the regulation of erythropoiesis, red cell mass, and plasma volume in adults with growth hormone deficiency., J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1997 Sep;82(9):2985-90
10. The Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism Vol. 87, No.8 3573-3577
11. Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab. 2002 Mar;282(3):E601-7.
12. Testosterone blunts feedback inhibition of growth hormone secretion by experimentally elevated insulin-like growth factor-I concentrations.J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2005 Mar;90(3):1613-7. Epub 2004 Dec 7.
13. Comparison of the Metabolic Effects of Raloxifene and Oral [Link niet meer beschikbaar] in Postmenopausal and Growth Hormone-Deficient Women.J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2005 Apr 26; [Epub ahead of print]
14. Serum insulin-like growth factor I levels in growth hormone-deficient adults: influence of coïtus steroids.Horm Res. 2004;62 Suppl 1:73-6.
15. Growth hormone enhances effects of endurance training on oxidative muscle metabolism in elderly women. Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab, Nov 2000; 279: 989 - 996.
16. J Gerontol A Biol Sci Med Sci 1998 May;53(3):M183-7

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edit: die bijwerkingen in je handen kan je trouwens grotendeels oplossing door extra vitamine B6 te nemen
200mgs B6 2 a 3 keer per dag, alleen dat helpt niet bij iedereen.

 

[Leviathan]

Ik ken iemand die sth aan klanten verkoopt die niet eens trainen.

Beetje dure hobby als je er dan ook nog eens erg weinig voor terug krijgt.

 

[LangeMan]

Ik ken iemand die sth aan klanten verkoopt die niet eens trainen.
Beetje dure hobby als je er dan ook nog eens erg weinig voor terug krijgt.

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tja, ligt er ook aan waar zij die sth voor gebruiken, voor massa schiet het idd niet op in dat geval

 

[dennis999]

LOL, voel je niet zo aangevallen man
a) Ik schreeuw niet zo maar wat, want ik heb onderzoeken gelezen,
ik heb alleen geen zin om me tijd te verdoen om dat op te zoeken,
dat mag WINSTROLST zelf op zijn gemak even doen.
Ik zie trouwens ook bijna nooit onderzoeken door andere members gepost
als zij in discussie gaan, maar dat terzijde, ik ben even lui.
b) Ik weet dat men hier niet zo dol is op GH gebruikt voor andere doeleinden
dan voor massa tijdens je kuur, vandaar dat ik er ook geen zin in heb
om erover te praten.
c) Medewerkers van CAD hebben ook vaak geen gebruikers ervaring
maar weten meer van drugs af dan ik.
d) Als ik geen blessure had dan was ik nu best groot dankzij hard trainen en goed eten
aangezien ik nooit een training of een maaltijd liet staan en super motivatie erin heb.
Garnaal moet je me maar noemen als ik voor je neus sta smurf.
En ja, ik ken de lange termijn gevolgen van sth (misbruik) dat weten
zelfs mensen die zich er niet eens in verdiept hebben.
Bedankt dat je me een slimme man noemt
want dat probeerde ik niet te zijn namelijk.
En ouwe is trouwens een term zoals bro OUWUH
Sorry dat ik je gekwets heb opa

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hahaha, is al prima jong

 

[ll cool j]

@LangeMan: Dat stukje was uit anabolicreview. Had t ook gelezen, maar dacht dat je hiervoor ook igf-1 kon gebruiken en dan zou ik dus voor dit kiezen.

 

[Ryu]

maar de topic starter heeft 2 verschillende dingen in zicht. De titel zegt groeit en de conclussie is ineens onderhoudt?

 

[Anoniem1983]

Ik ken iemand die sth aan klanten verkoopt die niet eens trainen.
Beetje dure hobby als je er dan ook nog eens erg weinig voor terug krijgt.

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Dan doet ie het goed in zijn geval als handelaar

 

[WINSTROLST]

onderhoud zou al relaxt zijn natuurlijk maar ( ryu ) ik denk niet dat ik groei moet verwachten zonder te trainen dus laten we het op onderhoud houden .

Hoewel groei natuurlijk te gek zou zijn. Maar dat lijkt me niet rendabel aangezien iedereen dan ipv de sportschool op de bank kon gaan zitte voor de tv en groeien.

 

[LangeMan]

groei hoef je idd niet te verwachten zonder trainen, helaas

 

[G21]

je moet gewoon je verlies nemen, er zit niet anders op, gewoon herstellen, trainen en daarna weer gaan denken aan ondersteunende middelen.
je denkt nu op korte termijn..!

succes!

 

[LangeMan]

@LangeMan: Dat stukje was uit anabolicreview. Had t ook gelezen, maar dacht dat je hiervoor ook igf-1 kon gebruiken en dan zou ik dus voor dit kiezen.

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sorry ik zie net pas je post

Maar dat klopt ja, IGF werkt volgens sommigen zelfs nog beter !

 

[Ryu]

damm sth hgh Igf ...

What the **** happend met de simpele primo of anavar?

 

[Testo]

damm sth hgh Igf ...
What the **** happend met de simpele primo of anavar?

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Hetzelfde als met de stoomtrein,bro....

 

[kevinlorenzin]

Hetzelfde als met de stoomtrein,bro....

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[Ryu]

Hetzelfde als met de stoomtrein,bro....

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Als die stoomtrein was gebleven zaten mensen later niet te mierennken over bijwerking die eerst nog niet bekend waren.. ( zoals blaadjes op de rails... oh brother.. )

 

[Testo]

Tsja ach,sinds de Sprinter de stoomtrein verdrong zijn er ook een stuk meer ongelukken gebeurd maar dat houdt de evolutie toch ook niet tegen,bro...

Vergeet niet dat er nu véél meer mensen dan vroeger anabolen gebruiken dus dan is het niet gek dat je ook meer gevallen hoort waarbij het misgaat omdat simpelweg elk mens anders is en van zichzelf al aandoeningen kan hebben waardoor de gezondheid evengoed wel aangetast zou worden.

 

[Ryu]

Tsja ach,sinds de Sprinter de stoomtrein verdrong zijn er ook een stuk meer ongelukken gebeurd maar dat houdt de evolutie toch ook niet tegen,bro...
Vergeet niet dat er nu véél meer mensen dan vroeger anabolen gebruiken dus dan is het niet gek dat je ook meer gevallen hoort waarbij het misgaat omdat simpelweg elk mens anders is en van zichzelf al aandoeningen kan hebben waardoor de gezondheid evengoed wel aangetast zou worden.

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dikke duim voor jouw

ben met je eens hoor.

 

[Testo]

Grazie,signor!

Altijd leuk om te horen.

 

[LangeMan]

Tsja ach,sinds de Sprinter de stoomtrein verdrong zijn er ook een stuk meer ongelukken gebeurd maar dat houdt de evolutie toch ook niet tegen,bro...
Vergeet niet dat er nu véél meer mensen dan vroeger anabolen gebruiken dus dan is het niet gek dat je ook meer gevallen hoort waarbij het misgaat omdat simpelweg elk mens anders is en van zichzelf al aandoeningen kan hebben waardoor de gezondheid evengoed wel aangetast zou worden.

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idd, en sommigen kunnen er simpelweg niet mee omgaan en doen maar wat